Disputatio:tlacohtli

Declinatio

From the entry:

• What's "[??]" (added), i.e. what do rows/colums represent?
  • "indef. poss.", "I. sing. poss." &c. seem to stand for the possessor.
  • "I. sing.", "II. sing." &c. seem to stand for the subject. Though: What's with the object?
• Compared with [en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_Nahuatl_grammar#Noun_inflection] (not a reliable source though) there seem to be differences between this table and en.wp.
• "I. sing. poss." (once "I sing. pos."):
  • 1. possessor, possessive &c. is commonly abbreviated poss. and not pos. (though there might be differened English handlings, but then they'd be uncivilised, degenerated).
  • 2. Is it really "I" (= one in English) and not "I." (= first in English)? Compared with en.wp ("Possessor prefixes" & "1st person singular") it should be "I.".
  • 3. What should "I[.] sing. pos[s]." mean? In English it could be "first person singular possessor", like my as in e.g. my slave. But in Latin? "prima persona singularis possessoris" (first person [of the] singular of the possessor) and "primae personae singularis possessor" (possessor of the first person singular) don't make sense or at least seem to make no sense. Maybe it should be like "possessor: I. sing." which then shall mean something like "the possessor is the first person singular = the possessor is I = it translates to my".

An another table version, though maybe "poss." should also stand before "abs.":

Still:

• What's with the object?
• Accourding to en.wp the plural subjects are like "prefix (+ verb +) -h", so the plural subjects would be incomplete/wrong.
• Or: Maybe it can be without subject and object, but what should those persons mean? en.wp only has singular and plural which should be combinable like this (possessive of tlācohtli = slave is the one from tlatlācah = person accourding to en.wt/en.wp):

		num.			English
		sing.	plur.
abs.		tlācatl tlācohtli	tlatlācah tlātlācohtin		person[s] slave[s]
poss.	indef.	tētlācauh	tētlācahuān		somebody's person[s] (slave[s])
	I. sing.	notlācauh	notlācahuān		my person[s] (slave[s])
	II. sing.	motlācauh	motlācahuān		thy person[s] (slave[s])
	III. sing.	ītlācauh	ītlācahuān		his (her, its) person[s] (slave[s])
	I. plur.	totlācauh	totlācahuān		our person[s] (slave[s])
	II. plur.	anmotlācauh	anmotlācahuān		your person[s] (slave[s])
	III. plur.	īntlācauh	īntlācahuān		their person[s] (slave[s])

The thing with the 6 person should be a verb thing, which in present should look like this (subject • object • V (= some verb) [◦ h (a part of the plural subject)]; where "◦" is not present in usual typing but an addition here so it should be easier to split the verb forms):

		obj.
		indef.	I. sing.	II. sing.	III. sing.	I. plur.	II. plur.	III. plur.
subj.	indef.	tē◦tla◦V	tē◦nēch◦V	tē◦mitz◦V	tē◦qui◦V	tē◦tēch◦V	tē◦amēch◦V	tē◦quim◦V
	I. sing.	ni◦tla◦V	ni◦nēch◦V	ni◦mitz◦V	ni◦qui◦V	ni◦tēch◦V	ni◦amēch◦V	ni◦quim◦V
	II. sing.	ti◦tla◦V	ti◦nēch◦V	ti◦mitz◦V	ti◦qui◦V	ti◦tēch◦V	ti◦amēch◦V	ti◦quim◦V
	III. sing.	◦tla◦V	◦nēch◦V	◦mitz◦V	◦qui◦V	◦tēch◦V	◦amēch◦V	◦quim◦V
	I. plur.	ti◦tlaV◦h	ti◦nēch◦V◦h	ti◦mitz◦V◦h	ti◦qui◦V◦h	ti◦tēch◦V◦h	tia◦mēch◦V◦h	ti◦quim◦V◦h
	II. plur.	an◦tlaV◦h	an◦nēch◦V◦h	an◦mitz◦V◦h	an◦qui◦V◦h	an◦tēch◦V◦h	an◦amēch◦V◦h	an◦quim◦V◦h
	III. plur.	◦tla◦V◦h	◦nēch◦V◦h	◦mitz◦V◦h	◦qui◦V◦h	◦tēch◦V◦h	◦amēch◦V◦h	◦quim◦V◦h

In English that would be this:

		obj.
		indef.	I. sing.	II. sing.	III. sing.	I. plur.	II. plur.	III. plur.
subj.	indef.	somebody/something did something to somebody/something	somebody/something did something to me	somebody/something did something to thou	somebody/something did something to him (her, it)	somebody/something did something to us	somebody/something did something to you	somebody/something did something to them
	I. sing.	I did something to somebody/something	I did something to me
	II. sing.	thou did something to somebody/something
	III. sing.	he (her, it) did something to somebody/something
	I. plur.	we did something to somebody/something
	II. plur.	you did something to somebody/something
	III. plur.	they did something to somebody/something

Furthermore there might be (partly) absolut forms, e.g. a form without subject, which might form a passiv (like: he got hit), or a form without object, which might form intransitive verbs (like: he sleept).
Combinations of nouns and verbs seem to be like "[verb: I--you--do-something, i.e. I do something to you] [subject: I] [object: my person/slave]" (I do something to you, my person/slave) resp. "[verb: He--him--do-something, i.e. he does something to him] [subject: he = a person] [object: him = (my, his, ...) slave]" (a person does something to (a; my, his, ...) slave).
PS: Maybe the first table includes sentences like "I [am a] slave" (nitlācohtli), "I [am] thy person/slave" (nimotlācahui) &c., cf. wp: "ticihuātl, 'you (singular) are a woman' (sentence with a noun predicate cihuātl, 'woman')" and "Affixes for the arguments of the verb (subject [...])". But that doesn't seem to be part of inflection and can be constructed by "[verb affix for the subject][(real) inflected form of a noun]". -01:50, 23 Martii 2015 (UTC)